The issues flat earthers have with the heliocentric model are:

1. You cannot see the curve of the earth (sideways)
2. You cannot prove the curve of the earth over the horizon (sinking ships)
3. You cannot prove gravity
4. Nobody has ever been across the south pole
5. You cannot feel the motion of movement on the earth, and we cannot prove we are speeding across the galaxy at impossible speeds
6. The distance to the celestial objects have never been measured.

All examples provided are based on these 5 concepts.

The examples used to show the flatness of earth

1. If you turn 360o on the surface of the earth, the horizon is always level and flat.
2. Aircraft do not have to dip to fly, so there is no curve
3. People do not fall of the earth in southern hemisphere
4. People have seen things over the horizon, or tested with lasers
5. Clouds are seen behind the sun
6. Pictures from outside the earth are always composites of several 'flat' pictures
7. Pictures from weather balloons and aircraft do no show a curve.
8. Water is always level, so how can it curve
9. Aircraft, birds can fly, but the oceans are pulled to the earth.
10. Super zoom camera's show a whole boat.

The examples to show the distance to the moon/sun

1. Crepuscular sun rays prove the sun is close
2. The sun gets smaller when setting
3. The sun is exactly as big as the moon

To disprove a spinning globe, or moving globe

1. Aircraft take the same time to traverse the from east to west as west to east
2. If you throw a ball up, it will come down on the same spot
3. The same star patterns have been visible for centuries
4. We do not feel the earth moving

And what do they use to provide explanations:

1. Sun and moon movements are just perspective
2. Seasons are formed because of the distance to the sun
3. Gravity is explained through buoyancy and density

The main point is that you cannot prove the globe model. With tools on this earth, without referring to things beyond the literal border of our experience. This means that you cannot 'invent' a system of rules with which to prove that what we cannot touch or measure with physical tools.

That means that you cannot use things like triangulation with the sun, or stars, to calculate a distance on earth, as we do not KNOW the distance to the stars, sun and moon. This assuming that we did not go to the moon.

The user experience is that almost everyone on earth has never seen the curve of the earth. All we see is a flat horizon.

And I do not write, prove, because finding proof is hard.

 Topic Question Example Sun & Moon How does the angular size of the Sun does not change? How can we see the sun move at the same speed in winter, as in summer on the equator What causes solar/lunar eclipses How are we able to predict solar eclipses and equinoxes, which are based on mathematical formulas and a globe model. How do seasons work, why is there a difference in southern and northern summers/winters? How can we see the same angle to sun and moon on Stars and planets How do southern hemisphere stars revolve around a single point and see the same star pattern everywhere on the southern hemisphere What is the mathematics behind the movement of the stars and celestial bodies? Where did Aristarchus, Eratosthenes and Kepler go wrong in calculating the distances between celestial objects? Maps Why is it impossible to create a (flat) map with both distance and angles correct? How can current models work (google maps/earth, Stellarium, SolarSystemScope)? How does GPS and Glonass work? Gravity Why is there gravity? If everything we observe about the solar (the path of the planets around the sun, and moons around the planets), why does that not apply to us (i.e. Gravity)? Why is there a direction of gravity? How do tides work? Density and Buoyancy Why is there a direction? And why is this direction up/down and not any other direction? What is the force causing this? Curvature Why do we see curvature in viewing mountains at a distance, that cannot be explained on a flat earth, even with extreme refraction? Why do we see only the top of ships and lighthouses and not the bottom, unless they are compressed How does refraction work on a flat-earth, as the layers of air are not bend and light should travel straight through these layers Seismology How does sound travel through the earth, from one place to another, from any spot on the earth to the opposite spot, regardless of the position on the globe ? How do earthquakes sound maps go around the globe, and around again? Do Earthquakes (dis)prove Flat Earth? Magnetic Field How do compasses work on a flat-earth model? Why do we need different compasses on the southern and northern hemisphere, to compensate the tilt How is earth's magnetic field generated?

## Flat Earth Resources

Jeranism

JTolan

Phuketword

Flat earth Talk

### Flat Earth Text Sources on Internet

The Flat Earth Society

The Flat Earth Society (also but different)

### Globe Earth Sources

Vsause A popsci channel

Conspiracy Cats

Bob The Scientist

Wolfe6020

Rory

SciManDan

GreaterSapien

Nasa

### Round Earth Text

https://flatearth.ws/

MetaBunk

### Tools

Walter Bislin's curve Calculator

Matabunk Calculator

SunCalc.org (to find angles of sun at specific time and place

The Complete Circular Arc Calculator

Peakfinder: Tool

PeakVisor : What's the name and the altitude of that mountain?

Create a visualisation of what you would see from a specific viewpoint